tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1462946535883846881.post5856883261022788756..comments2024-03-17T16:32:51.970-04:00Comments on Vast Public Indifference: Pixar's Gender ProblemCDhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/14390048358391513711noreply@blogger.comBlogger107125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1462946535883846881.post-87773715028534812552012-07-04T12:27:26.888-04:002012-07-04T12:27:26.888-04:00it's now 2012 and I still think the issue is i...it's now 2012 and I still think the issue is important.<br /><br />-<br />Brave is the only ONE pixar's movie with concerns of a LEAD female characters.<br /><br />the only one<br /><br />and for that, they needed to make her a "princess".<br /><br />I will welcome Brave: the character is genuinely interesting, red hair as I'm fond of, and the movie is about HER.<br /><br />but truly, I just would like a movie about common "people" in their world, and the lead is just simply a woman.oomuhttp://o.orgnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1462946535883846881.post-70673561241347221842012-07-03T12:21:53.007-04:002012-07-03T12:21:53.007-04:00I would love to hear your thoughts on Brave! Whil...I would love to hear your thoughts on Brave! While I still want to see Pixar tell a story about a non-princess girl who goes on an adventure, I was happy to see them look at mother/daughter relationships (there's a lot of good scholarship on fathers in Disney and on the absence of mothers).Jenniferhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12224748072789873249noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1462946535883846881.post-23360124084487655582012-06-16T10:27:08.847-04:002012-06-16T10:27:08.847-04:00nice writtennice writtenhttp://sportsfunia.comhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12260310493503737307noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1462946535883846881.post-59556847897297472462012-02-15T15:32:16.976-05:002012-02-15T15:32:16.976-05:00I feel like there are many other films such as all...I feel like there are many other films such as all the musical movies such as beauty and the beast, cinderella, snow white, sleeping beauty, alice in wonderland, the aristocrats, the princess and the frog, and many others that are directed towards the female protagonists. No one is making a big deal about that... Pixar decided to take an opposite role and make it about the male gender too, I don't see a problem with this. I feel if you do you are making a silly feminist issue.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1462946535883846881.post-79621106759114926052011-11-23T02:31:47.113-05:002011-11-23T02:31:47.113-05:00I came upon this after reading a few other more re...I came upon this after reading a few other more recent blog entries, and all I can say is wow! I think I love you. Especially after the comment about And about thinking critically about the culture we are submerged in, and Galen and whatnot. I have been thinking those same things about gender and have struggled so much to put them into words! I had never thought about Pixar movies in that way, but, man. Spot on. Totally spot on.<br />And I say nertz to all the haters tellin' you that you have some "issue" with gender and "why can't you feminists just relax and stop seeing gender everywhere? everything is already how it's supposed to be, now stop making me upset." Keep doin' your thang.Carrie Tnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1462946535883846881.post-60404237878614869422011-08-07T16:01:43.447-04:002011-08-07T16:01:43.447-04:00Heh! Thanks for writing this. I was going to make ...Heh! Thanks for writing this. I was going to make a similar post, until Googling it and realizing you'd already made these points three years ago. I was feeling optimistic about 'Brave' (formerly The Bear and the Bow), but that princess thing does reduce my enthusiasm a bit. I even really *like* Pixar's movies, it's just...*sigh*. Yeah. Why don't they have a clue on this one point? <br /><br />-Molly (mollyringle.com)Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1462946535883846881.post-28762413882553168042011-06-04T10:00:26.474-04:002011-06-04T10:00:26.474-04:00It's not just in Pixar Movies. Video games al...It's not just in Pixar Movies. Video games also suffer from the male heavy aspect with more male leads than female leads, and most female leads being little more than support roles or made to cater to a male fantasy of how what they want women to be.<br /><br />Rockstar for example ahve never once had a female lead in their games, they've always gone for males.<br />They tend to make woman as targets and sex toys for males, it's pretty much gone to show that they are a pretty sexist company with a deep hatred towards women.<br />The same with Activision who refuse to have female characters in games unless they're made to be sex toys for the males.<br /><br />The media is largely run by males who tend to be sexist towards any female who tries to offer ideas, suggestions, anything to offer new ideas to a stale media full of male centric views and ideas.<br /><br />Sadly it's not looking like the media will ever grow up beyond the 'Be a man!' mindset for a very long time.Reinanoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1462946535883846881.post-59613779096417449152011-05-23T08:57:58.377-04:002011-05-23T08:57:58.377-04:00Hey -
I'm regrettably late to the party, but ...Hey -<br /><br />I'm regrettably late to the party, but I just want to voice my support as a male. People can dismiss this all they want but it is a very serious systemic problem with our society, and the people who act like it's nothing, or worse yet some form of zealous, irrational feminism, are egregiously ignorant of its broader implications.<br /><br />The male = default/female = special case thing is absolutely out of control in our culture, and it's something that attention needs to be given to. This occurs to such a ridiculous level that "girl" is often treated a as a character archetype alongside "smart guy", "funny guy", "dopey guy", and "strong guy"- there's this ridiculous presentation that diversity only exists among males and that females are very homogeneous by nature. Contrary to what most Americans seem to think, the US is behind most of the developed world in most forms of social progress, including the eradication of the dominant/subordinate construction of gender. A far greater percentage of foreign films have female protagonists as well as better ratios of male to female characters; and Disney/Pixar are among the worst offenders of perpetuating this goofy, nonsensical paradigm by having 4:1 ratios of males to females in all of their movies and having females only play one of two or three roles (sacrificing mother, obsessive love interest, or moral support).<br /><br />Someone earlier brought up the Peter/Lois dynamic that has become very popular in American comedy as a defense of the portrayal of female characters. In fact, it's the opposite. The reason you see this so often is because women are never considered to be capable of carrying the humor of a show or an act, so that (dominant) role is given to the man while the woman plays his (subordinate) straight-man. It's every bit as insulting to women as to men if not more so.<br /><br />There's also no reason at all why men can't or shouldn't be able to write really good female characters or good stories that revolve around female characters. It isn't that difficult to relate to someone of the opposite sex, our society fabricates that difficulty by exaggerating and endlessly reinforcing stereotypes of gender constructs. <br /><br />Honestly, I find the whole thing completely ridiculous.Kevinhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06620555386384790696noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1462946535883846881.post-60425221374492946012011-02-15T16:50:49.333-05:002011-02-15T16:50:49.333-05:00Terrific article -- though it's disheartening ...Terrific article -- though it's disheartening to see the same old, tired non-arguments trotted out in Pixar's defense.<br /><br />All Pixar films are bromances of the fat slob/hot nag variety. It’s indicative that the sole Pixar film with original plans to have a female director and hero first underwent a gender change in its director, then got shoved off to Disney. Perhaps in fear of giving the rest of the Pixar works and crew girl cooties.<br /><br />A bit more on the non-arguments:<br /><a href="http://www.starshipreckless.com/blog/?p=712" rel="nofollow">Is It Something in the Water? Or, Me Tarzan, You Ape</a>Athena Andreadishttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07650180659001228746noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1462946535883846881.post-51441189010343789032011-01-19T20:11:30.913-05:002011-01-19T20:11:30.913-05:00Thanks for this spot-on argument. I couldn't a...Thanks for this spot-on argument. I couldn't agree with you more. I love Pixar movies, but it becomes so tiresome being told over and over again by our culture that women and girls' stories aren't worth telling. <br /><br />To all the commenters who mentioned that we will only be happy with a 100% female cast: No. We want SOME Pixar films to SOMETIMES have a female main character. Of their current movies out, there are exactly 0 female leads... that sounds fair to you? Women don't deserve to be the main character ever?captainnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1462946535883846881.post-36938888118052153492010-12-09T16:05:43.425-05:002010-12-09T16:05:43.425-05:00'But if flick was a female then you can't ...'But if flick was a female then you can't establish a relationship with Atta.<br />Sure, they could've been friends. But that doesn't impact me as much as an actual love relationship between a male servant and a princess.'<br /><br />So you're saying it would've been impossible to have had an 'actual love' relationship between two female characters? Because... children don't believe in lesbians? Not only can you see massive problems concerning gender when looking at Pixar films, but also concerning sexuality. Pixar protagonists are not only always male, but the implication is that they are also heteronormative. Of course, while I'm sure this is how the creators intended the characters to be perceived, there's no reason to assume they are straight, rather than bisexual (in those films where this a female romantic interest- in those without, the characters could be as easily read as being gay).<br /><br />For an interesting anylsiss of sexuality and gender in WALL.E, I'd seriously recommend reading Kate Bornstein's blog article: http://katebornstein.typepad.com/kate_bornsteins_blog/2008/07/walle-a-butchfe.htmlMonsieur Clopinnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1462946535883846881.post-76426508174307299792010-12-02T14:07:13.327-05:002010-12-02T14:07:13.327-05:00I actually would like to take back what I said abo...I actually would like to take back what I said about people saying what they want about Toy Story. Woody and Buzz are males because their owner is a boy. I already know what you're thinking.<br /><br />Why does Andy have to be a boy?<br /><br />Because the director was based Andy off of himself. He's said many times that he is Andy. He was that kid who didn't like breaking or blowing up his toys. <br /><br />So, that logic is sound.Masonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14874333399902151696noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1462946535883846881.post-47177814327705469772010-12-02T13:43:15.541-05:002010-12-02T13:43:15.541-05:00Sorry, I was mistaken.
But if flick was a female ...Sorry, I was mistaken. <br />But if flick was a female then you can't establish a relationship with Atta.<br /><br />Sure, they could've been friends. But that doesn't impact me as much as an actual love relationship between a male servant and a princess.Masonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14874333399902151696noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1462946535883846881.post-17757275012984987132010-12-02T13:30:07.294-05:002010-12-02T13:30:07.294-05:00Mason,
You are mistaken. Worker ants are sterile ...Mason,<br /><br />You are mistaken. Worker ants are sterile females. Male ants are drones. It's the same way with bees. This is elementary-school level biology.<br /><br />You are absolutely correct that the narrative demands that Flik be a worker ant. In nature, worker ants are female. In order to satisfy their wish to have a male lead, the writers ignored what they learned in 3rd grade and created a male worker ant.Caitlin GD Hopkinshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05317897772288904474noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1462946535883846881.post-70817145106086737462010-12-02T12:46:20.112-05:002010-12-02T12:46:20.112-05:00I want to clear up some things about "a Bugs ...I want to clear up some things about "a Bugs Life."<br /><br />You're all right about the fact that an ant hill is a female ant dominated community... Er, Empire?<br /><br />The reason the story works with a male ant lead is because male ants aren't the leaders. Flick is a nobody. A worker ant. A SERVANT. The opening scene (I'm LOST!)establishes that none of those worker ants are free thinkers. They must be guided in every step.<br />Flick is a free thinker. He creates things. He wants to improve the harvests for the grasshoppers so they can spend less time gathering.<br />So, we've already established that a female ant can't be the lead of "a Bug's Life" because THERE ARE NO FEMALE WORKER ANTS. It's as simple as that. <br />It's a story about a lowly slave solving a problem that his leaders were too afraid to deal with. <br /><br />People will probably say "Why didn't they get a different person from the colony that was a female? The lead doesn't have to be a worker ant."<br />Yes he does. A worker ant is the lowest on the ant totem pole. That gives us the lesson that no matter how unimportant you may seem, you can change the ideas of everyone around you. No matter who you are.<br /><br />You can ask "Why couldn't 'Toy Story' have been about two females?" all you want. But "a Bug's Life" is exactly the way it should be. The facts are there. The only thing that's different is this is a cartoon.Masonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14874333399902151696noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1462946535883846881.post-52859548623260427462010-11-19T21:36:38.412-05:002010-11-19T21:36:38.412-05:00Old discussion, older thread, but oh well.
emanong...Old discussion, older thread, but oh well.<br />emanonguy, <i>"Surely it would have been easier not to complete re-invision ant social structure?"<br />Couldn't they have simply written a story? Without thought of what gender? Applying Occam's razor, I'd guess that someone simply had a clever idea and was writing it from a male perspective well before someone said "Hey, but male ants don't do squat!" </i><br /><br />Then what stops them from, as you say, simply writing a story...with a female lead? There is nothing so outrageous about the characters of women that in the course of writing the tale of Awesome, Interesting Protagonist, that the protagonist must be and remain male. I'm not saying women and men are interchangeable, but when developing a hero's story of adventure and development and growth...what does the hero do that requires "him" to be a "hero"? When they were thinking up A Bug's Life, what is it about the main ant that it had to be a guy? What about that character was uniquely from the male perspective? (A separate issue: Why write a whole story about male ants before someone decides to do a small iota of research before dismissing the idea of a female-dominated world? OR why not write from the perspective of more familiar creatures who aren't clearly based in reality as female-leading?)Elainehttp://www.grassytread.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1462946535883846881.post-49836495272188405392010-10-22T00:57:38.947-04:002010-10-22T00:57:38.947-04:00Hi! I'm trying to write a research paper compa...Hi! I'm trying to write a research paper comparing the Disney movie and Miyazaki's movies in the influence it has over sex-role and gender stereotypes and how it may affect kids .. I found a lot of ressources of studies about Disney movies and their influence on children, but cant find anything about Miyazaki's work! I was wondering if you knew about articles or books that have been published about it; as I really enjoyed learning and thinking about those issues while reading all those different comments.. <br />Thankyou!vicnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1462946535883846881.post-72930242003677373282010-06-28T17:46:11.485-04:002010-06-28T17:46:11.485-04:00Part of the problem is that filmmakers are scared ...Part of the problem is that filmmakers are scared to do certain things to a female character. Female characters like Edna and Sally would be rejected by the public if they were swapped with the lead. Would the public accept it if Lighting mcqueen was the reason Sally was stuck with community service? Probably not. Also many these filmmakers come into a movie with a dream or set of ideas that have been with them since they were children. When they come up with the characters they relate them to their own experiences and changing them often causes their ideas to be ruined. Simple ideology such as "don't hit a woman" (which you still should never do)limit the flexibility of the filmmaker because their reputation and the profit of a movie are on the line. "Good" gender roles are often the ones that get in the way, not the stereotypes because the director is taught "how" to treat the other gender. Instead of respecting someone because of their individuality you respect someone just because she is a woman. Although I agree partially with you, the overwhelming amount of misandry found in filmmaking, causes me to think that this is not a feminism issue as it is people not acknowledging the variety of people out there and not respecting one because they are not an individual.Kyoshihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09803954282161124704noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1462946535883846881.post-87222167660761399762010-06-23T15:38:48.031-04:002010-06-23T15:38:48.031-04:00Ha! Very interesting. I never thought of it that w...Ha! Very interesting. I never thought of it that way before. It did seem like an uncharacteristic "slip" from someone who thinks about texts and language so carefully. Thanks for clarifying!Bradyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00264395032836773602noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1462946535883846881.post-56250141800698648572010-06-22T20:17:37.726-04:002010-06-22T20:17:37.726-04:00Thanks for commenting!
I see where you're goi...Thanks for commenting!<br /><br />I see where you're going with the "douchebag" comment, but I assure you that I use the term in a considered way. Since a douche is an cosmetic product that implies that vaginas are smelly and dirty and need to be cleaned out with harsh chemicals, I consider the epithet "douchebag" to be an appropriate synonym for "jerk," especially when the jerkiness is manifested in malice toward women. Douches are bad for vaginas, and douchebags are usually bad for women.Caitlin GD Hopkinshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05317897772288904474noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1462946535883846881.post-79383493432115439352010-06-22T19:23:56.548-04:002010-06-22T19:23:56.548-04:00Also, I really loved your quip about Cars in the m...Also, I really loved your quip about Cars in the main post. I actually laughed out loud. But as a feminist, I have to object to the use of the word "douchebag." <br /><br />As I said before, though, loved everything else about it.Bradyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00264395032836773602noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1462946535883846881.post-4159504781530036792010-06-22T19:18:35.949-04:002010-06-22T19:18:35.949-04:00Wow. Wow. Wow. Just found this while researching ...Wow. Wow. Wow. Just found this while researching Pixar info for my own females-in-movies blog. I linked to you on it: http://msjonesmovies.blogspot.com/2010/06/i-must-be-on-pixar-kick.html<br /><br />3 things:<br /><br />1) You cannot understand how much I loved this post.<br /><br />2) I'm amazed at how violently people argued against your ideas! Really eye-opening. And disheartening.<br /><br />3) You're such a good, funny writer, you make me just want to quit my own blog. Could never be this awesome. :)Bradyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00264395032836773602noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1462946535883846881.post-40701140198914415722009-11-19T14:34:57.965-05:002009-11-19T14:34:57.965-05:00@Carrie Don't you think it's a little sad ...@Carrie Don't you think it's a little sad that Selick decided to add that goofy male character ("Wybee") into Coraline? Originally, Coraline was all by herself--all she had was that cat to help her. Why does she need that goofy male character? I applaud Neil Gaiman for having a strong central female character, all alone, dealing with those tremendously scary problems. (I think it also makes it scarier, which might be part of the motivation behind why Selick chose to add "Wybee," but it could have just as easily been a girl, fer chrissakes.)a.https://www.blogger.com/profile/16634218963878180505noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1462946535883846881.post-2368004448338604292009-07-04T17:02:49.416-04:002009-07-04T17:02:49.416-04:00I'm a big fan of the Pixar movies, but I'v...I'm a big fan of the Pixar movies, but I've always found it terribly disappointing that they seem to be so male oriented -- there's a stupid idea floating around Hollywood that girls will go see a movie about a boy, but that the reverse won't happen, and so the movies won't sell, and Hollywood being all about the money, these movies don't get made. I thought The Incredibles was the best woman-positive movie they've made. Elastogirl, Violet, and the wonderful Edna were all strong female leads, and this is the only movie I bought for my daughters. The other movies (with the exception of Cars, which stinks on ice, and Up, where we once more go to the male centric story) are pretty cute, but they're not very strongly on the female side. Even though they might have some goodish female characters such as Eve, they fall short because of the character being there as part of an unnecessary love story. I wish Pixar would get with the program -- they are very good when it comes to imagery and effects; but they neglect 51% of the population of the world. Having gender neutral characters who are strong and positive would be a gigantic step forward, and then they could grow up and start having good female leads. ~CharlesVVhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06718569163213768692noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1462946535883846881.post-24428331534671181482009-07-04T15:51:41.188-04:002009-07-04T15:51:41.188-04:00"Unfortunately, I had to deduct points for th..."Unfortunately, I had to deduct points for the writers' going out of their way to turn a female-dominated community into a male-dominated movie. To what end?"<br />To be fair, you shouldn't single Pixar out for this. Pretty much everybody does this with social insects...Blue Makohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14421057317339004353noreply@blogger.com